Sony KDL-46S2010 problem


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Sony KDL-46S2010 problem

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vger
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Jul 27, 2009, 1:27 PM

Post #1 of 20 (11943 views)
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Sony KDL-46S2010 problem	Can't Post

Greetings,
I'm new to this forum, but not to electronics. I have a Sony KDL-46S2010 that is partially dead. When powered on, the power LED lights (not blinking) and after the normal delay the LCD backlights come on. The Screen is dark with no image whatsoever. There is no audio at all. The only button (set top or remote) that does anything is the power button. Cannot access the menu, nor do I get any image at all.
I am thinking it is going to be the BU board ???? Anyone had a similar problem with one of these? There are several models in this series...
KDL-23S2010, KDL-26S2010, KDL-32S2010, KDL-40S2010, and of course the KDL-46S2010.
I have a copy of the service manual for the series, but it is not much help with this problem.
Any help would be apreciated.
Thanks
Steve

tscheucher
User

Jul 27, 2009, 5:22 PM

Post #2 of 20 (11934 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Steve!
There are several issues due to that kinda problem.
- At first check if there is a bad plug - connection between the boards, especially the one which is directly located obove the tuner assy.
- Probably try to clean the connectors with self evaporating tuner spray in case of dust or oxidized metal surfaces.
- Secondly check the transistors: Q6501, Q6502, Q6503 and Q6504 for short circuiting (If so - secondary power supply is partly dead - replace the PSU=power supply unit as a whole)
- Check (SMD/chip) fuses on screen driver board.
The main thing is that you will not get around a complete check of the supply voltages in order to avoid further damage, because the boards are corresponding (communicating) to each other and there may be some loop-through connections with the same voltage which means that several boards can take damage simultaniuosly.
You evan wrote that you have service manual - So fixing the power supply will be no big deal. Let me know if you were successful or not!
best regards
Thomas

vger
New User

Jul 27, 2009, 8:11 PM

Post #3 of 20 (11927 views)
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Re: [tscheucher] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thomas,
Thanks, will check all supply voltages this evening.
I tried reseating all the connectors.... will try cleaning them too. The set is very clean (no dust to speak of) but will try some dust off on the boards just in case.
Thanks for the quick reply. And I will let you know how I come out.
Steve
PS, after I get this one figured out, I can get back to "enhancing" the grandsons power-wheels jeep. :)

vger
New User

Jul 29, 2009, 12:39 PM

Post #4 of 20 (11918 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thomas,
All voltages from on the G2 supply board are correct.. and power in to each board is correct. 9V regulator on BU board is good. Heartbeat LED on QS board blinks at 1Hz rate.
Still scratching my head...
Steve

vger
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Jul 29, 2009, 2:37 PM

Post #5 of 20 (11913 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Partial success.... I have audio, but still no display. Tuner works and can change channels. Now I am thinking the LCD driver board may be the issue..... Still checking.
Steve

vger
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Jul 29, 2009, 4:37 PM

Post #6 of 20 (11910 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

I grabbed my O-scope and probed the signal lines going to the LCD driver board. I can see the scope trace change as the video changes in the program. I've not been able to identify a fuse on the LCD driver ( 460WSC4LV2.3 ) and that board is not in the service manual.
Is the fuse the SMD that is green with a P on it? If so, then it's open, and..... there is no 5V anywhere on the LCD driver board. Now to determin what rating the fuse is????
Steve

vger
New User

Jul 30, 2009, 7:05 PM

Post #7 of 20 (11897 views)
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Re: [tscheucher] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thomas,
It was the fuse.... I jumpered across the fuse and picture is great! I carefully checked all components on the driver board for over heating and all seems fine. I would like to eventually replace the fuse with an actual fuse though. Would you happen to know the rating on it? 1A?

Thanks so much for the help.
Steve

tscheucher
User

Jul 31, 2009, 8:36 AM

Post #8 of 20 (11887 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Steve!
Nice to hear that Sony LCD�s can be fixed that quickly - The last two I had were really complicated to get back alive. Mostly their software is down and they indicate a hardware failure.
For the fuse, at best you take a 1,25A SMD type fuse, which is commonly used in Samsung devices for the LCD driver. It isn�t a that big issue, because once I was told by samsung�s technical information center (on the phone) that such driver boards aren�t even consumpting more than 0,8A for operation.
The greenish "glaslike" chip component is indeed a smd fuse - One of the new generation to shrink manufacturers building space via production.
I would recommend you to take a IC - fuse. These ones which come in a round plastic case of about 8mm in diameter if you have enough space inside the metal shielding to place it there. Just solder the leads directly on the pcb - position of the old one.
If the fuse blows again, try to search for temporary short circuiting or if nothing suspective can be found, put a switching rectifier in series with the wire providing operation voltage for the board. Once I had troubles with a power supply unit which had a horrible ripple and that caused the fuse to blow at switchoff because the discharging peaks were to high. The diode smooth�s the voltage a bit and causes a bit of a voltage drop (about 0,7 -1,2V) which sometimes isn�t bad.
best regards
Thomas

vger
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Jul 31, 2009, 11:36 AM

Post #9 of 20 (11881 views)
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Re: [tscheucher] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thomas,
Either you are an early riser, or you are on the east coast. There is plenty of room to hang a fuse off the board if I run about 2 inches of wire out the slot area the input connector goes through. I could check the current being drawn by the board that way as well. I can recall checking power supply issues using a low ohm resistor (1 ohm or .1 ohm) in series with the load and connecting a scope across the resistor. That lets you look at the current waveform and you can very easily see if there are high current spikes. Of course you have to use an isolation transformer on either the set or the scope so the ground clip on the scope doesn't short the supply to ground.
This is actually the first LCD TV set I have worked on. I think the last TV I worked on prior to this was when I was living in Phoenix in 1980 at which time I was teaching AM/FM radio and Television at Phoenix Institute of Technology. A lot has changed since then for sure. I did recently (about 4 months ago) repair 6 Infocus LP600 DLP projectors. All had identical "no power" issue that turned out to be the same power supply cap on each unit. The supply manufacturer had put an 85 deg C cap right next to a regulator IC and siliconed them together. Replacing them with 105 deg C caps was all it took.
I really appreciate your help with my sony set (my other half does too). I'll head to the local electronics component store and get an appropriate fuse and get it on there so just in case there is a major short at some point I don't end up killing the power supply. The local electronics store is one of those places that has rows and rows of shelves of bin boxes of components they have bought surplus over the years.
Now I can get back to building the PWM motor speed controller for the Power Wheels. Just retrofit the pedel with a spring loaded linear slide pot connected to the PWM controller and the grandson will have linear acceleration control.
Again, thanks for the assist!
Steve

Lysander
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Sep 23, 2012, 4:52 PM

Post #10 of 20 (10239 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi vger,
Unlike yourself I am not into electronicics though I am a maintenance electrician and I like to dable.
I have excactly the same problem on the same model of TV.
Can you please give me a little more info on where to find this fuse? I can't find it from the info in the post.
Any help would be appreciated.
Dave

vger
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Sep 23, 2012, 7:08 PM

Post #11 of 20 (10232 views)
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Re: [Lysander] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dave,

WOW, it's been a while since I made that post. OK, since then I moved that set into the bedroom and it's still working just fine.

The fuse is a surface mount fuse on the display driver board. That board is (viewed from the open back of the set) is at the very top, in the center. It has metal shielding around it that will have to be temporarily removed.

The connector at the bottom of that card brings power to the board on the left side (+5V) and goes directly to that fuse. You can actually see the trace go from the edge connector up and to the left and down to the fuse. The fuse is a different color (light green if I remember correctly) than all the other surface mount parts on that board. It is very small, about 2mm by 4mm or so. With no power connected to the set, it should read 0 Ohms across it with a multimeter if it's good. If Not, just solder a jumper wire across it using a small pencil iron (radio shack) and you may be good.

Steve

Lysander
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Sep 23, 2012, 8:10 PM

Post #12 of 20 (10228 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks for the reply Steve.
My TV is 26" not 46" but I have checked That central board (it's got the HDMI and VGA connectors on it)
The plug from the PSU board comes in at top left and has a marked surface mount fuse which reads 0 ohms across it.
Looks like I am not so lucky but as the TV is 8 years old I can't complain.
Thanks again for your help.
Dave

vger
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Sep 23, 2012, 9:16 PM

Post #13 of 20 (10221 views)
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Re: [Lysander] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

The board I had the problem with was fairly small, about 3 inches by 5 inches and had flat ribbons connecting to the LCD panel. Not the main board or power supply. It was separate from all the rest and not listed in the service manual as an individual board. It is "Part of the LCD panel" and comes as a set for replacement.

Lysander
New User

Sep 24, 2012, 1:15 AM

Post #14 of 20 (10217 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Am I looking at the wrong one? Is it the inverter board I should be looking at?
On mine that is the only other board behind a metal shielding, apart from the small CAM slot board, it's about 3 x 5 inches.
Dave

Justin325
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Mar 8, 2013, 4:54 PM

Post #15 of 20 (9649 views)
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Re: [vger] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Steve,
Thank you for posting this follow up. I got home last night to a broken KDL-46S2010 with the same symptoms as you had. I removed the TV from the wall, cracked open the back and found the LCD board and tested the small fuse and it appeared to be bad. I soldered and wire to jump the fuse and fired up the TV. I was amazed... it worked!!
I just want to thank you for your detailed explaination. I've attached a picture of the fuse incase others run across this thread and need a little help.

mel
Veteran

Mar 8, 2013, 11:33 PM

Post #16 of 20 (9636 views)
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Re: [Justin325] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

It is never a good idea to jumper a "wire" across a fuse Shocked

. It should only be replaced by a component of an equal value.

jts1957
Veteran

Mar 9, 2013, 5:39 PM

Post #17 of 20 (9621 views)
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Re: [Justin325] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

It's best to let the manufacturer (usually at the time of production) decide whether to wire in a fuse or use a jumper in place of it. Wink

-------------------------
Location: Far, Far Away

Justin325
New User

Mar 9, 2013, 6:17 PM

Post #18 of 20 (9613 views)
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Re: [jts1957] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Don't think I'm trying to undermind the manufacturers decision to place a fuse here. They placed a fuse in this spot for a specific reason and I understand that. THis TV is 8 years old, I have gotten 8 years of trouble-free use out of it. I understand that my decision to jump this fuse was due to the fact that I had nothing readily available to replace it. In addition, I'm assuming "hot-wiring" was probably easier than soldering an extremely small fuse in place. I understand I am now in "use at my own risk" mode. I accept that fact. I am an engineer, but by no means and electrical engineer.
This is becoming more an more relevant with the use of internet forums for fixing issues that one may not know much about. If it wasn't for this post I would have probably been shopping for a new TV this weekend. As best I would be searching for a new LCD driver board. Keep in mind I wouldn't have known for certain that that was the solution to my issue.
I posted this picture up for others that could possilby benefit from it. I appreciated Steve's detailed description so much it caused me to create an account and share my story and possible help others.

Ron.M
Veteran

Mar 9, 2013, 9:12 PM

Post #19 of 20 (9602 views)
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Re: [Justin325] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Justin325;.....

I do NOT work on LED/LCD or Plasma TVs....
That said;....
It is NEVER a good idea to short out a fuse with a jumper wire...
Makes about as much sense as bypassing a circuit breaker in your home...
The purpose of a fuse is to blow in the event of too much current being drawn thru the circuit..
A jumper wire will NOT blow...
IF a severe short were to develop , extreme damage to the TV that could result in a fire to your home or worse (???) is possible...
Now that you know the cause of the problem , I would strongly advise you to get the proper fuse;=>...."1.25A SMD type fuse" that "tscheucher" mentioned in post #8...
They should be available at a reputable electronic parts store...
(Forget Radio Shack..)

IF you can't replace the fuse yourself , get "the" fuse , remove the panel & take it to an honest , reputable TV repair shop to put it in for you..

Be safe.... Wink

....

Good Luck... Smile

....

Later...Ron.M.... Cool

...
Veteran & Retired TV technician

DiodeDan
New User

Mar 9, 2013, 11:14 PM

Post #20 of 20 (9594 views)
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Re: [Ron.M] Sony KDL-46S2010 problem [In reply to]	Can't Post

Remember Archie Bunker had a fire at his house when he bypassed a fuse with a penny!! Wink

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